I got arrested!

[DrivingZiggy]

I pull up to the gate at Fort Drum, NY. Had my gun cased and ready to turn over to the guard. He asks, I hand it over. However, they are using rent-a-cops now, and he didn't know what to do.

So he calls his boss who also doesn't know what to do. So the boss calls the local police. Hmmmmmmmm. They don't know what to do, either! Here comes an MP who thinks I'm in trouble for transporting a weapon across the state line.

Finally, somebody calls the state police. Meantime, they're all having a ball passing around my license and Louisiana concealed carry permit.

Trooper shows up and we go out to her car. She cuffs me for transport. We get to the HQ and the investigator (a plain clothes trooper) undoes one cuff and hooks me to the wall.

Then they have a confab going in another office with somebody else and I can only hear parts of it.

So what it boiled down to--at least what they informed me of--is that in NY even though my gun was unloaded, the magazines were in the same case with the gun which in NY is considered a loaded gun. Felony.

However, since I was so cooperative, the DA has agreed to lessen the charge to disorderly conduct.

So they cruise me back to my truck to get my fuel card and then on to the truck stop to get a cash advance and then to the court house. The judge walks in wearing jeans and T-shirt and proceeds to fine me $100 and $100 court costs.

Also, I don't get my gun back, it will probably be destroyed.

Does this all sound like everything was handled correctly? I mean, sure I may have been able to beat it with a lawyer. But I can't afford one and I had HMMWVs to deliver. So the quickest and easiest way to do it was to cop to disorderly conduct and get out of there. Plus, they informed me that with the misdemeanor conviction I can get another gun with no problem.

[Big_Dave]

The problem I can see with carrying a firearm in a CMV is this...........

There are so many different jurisdictions (state, county, city, township), and 'anti-concealed carry' laws out there that it isn't funny. :wtf:

While you have a LA CCW, NY may not honor it.

There's also some states in the N.E. that you can go to prison for 20 years if you're found to have a handgun in your possession or in your vehicle (whether you're commiting a crime or not). Virginia is one state that comes to mind.............if I'm not mistaken. :wtf:

So, it boils down to this........If it flies at home, it may not fly in Rome. Know what I mean? ;)

[DrivingZiggy]

Yes, I'm well aware. There are 31 States that recognize my concealed carry permit. However, it does not apply here. I was not carrying it, nor was it concealed.

It had been cased and under the bunk (not within reach) until I was approaching the gate at which time I brought it up front with me so that I could hand it to the guard.

According to the NY State Police, the only thing I did wrong was to have the ammunition in the same case with the gun. They consider a delivery on the base not to be a "substantial" stop, nor would spending the night in the rest area be a "substantial" stop. However, if I were to spend the night at a friend's house or go to dinner with somebody, that would violate the definition of going "through" the state.

New York does not recognize my permit, Virginia does.

And I carry a copy of "The Traveler's Guide to the Firearms Laws in the 50 States" with me. However, it failed to warn me that NY considers a weapon "loaded" if the ammunition is in the same case.

[beanie baby]

Dang Ziggy, your luck has been about as good as Dave's!! Sorry to hear that!


(Why didn't they keep him?!?! :rofl: ) :harhar:

[USAF_2T2]

I always thought that carrying a weapon (like a gun) was not allowed in a CMV. Am I wrong? I don't deal much with the CMV part of it.

[DrivingZiggy]

Perfectly legal as long as you conform to the laws of the state you're in.

I called 2 different DOT offices, U. S. Marshalls who referred me to BATF, then I drove to my local weigh station in my car. All gave me the same response: There is no federal law concerning weapons in CMVs.

Besides, if it was against the law, I'm sure they would have arrested me on that charge.

But they didn't. And they came back with the lesser charge without my even talking to anybody.

The more I have time to think about it, the more I feel like there's something that's just not right. It "feels" like I was only charged because there were so many incident reports filed by people who didn't know the law. It also feels like maybe they wanted a couple of hundred bucks in the local coffers. It also seems like maybe they wanted to keep my gun.

They made sure to tell me that one of the reasons for the lesser charge was so that I wouldn't have any problem getting another gun. They told me that the DA agreed to the lesser charge because I was cooperative. Now it just seems like they told me the things that would make me feel grateful/relaxed and just pay my fine and go on my way.

With a couple of HMMWVs on my trailer almost blocking the front gate, I really did need to get back to my truck and get offloaded. And if I was such a law-breaker, I'm sure I couldn't have been in-and-out of there in such a short time.

Darn lucky you werent in Massatchusets.....Most likely be looking at a felony right about now.. :yikes: .....

I dont know why anyone put themselves at risk, by carrying a firearm across state lines, especially someone that does a lot of military loads..

This is by no means an anti gun post......A person should have a right to carry a firearm....Just with the way these stupid liberal laws are, one never knows..

[Big_Dave]

A person should have a right to carry a firearm....Just with the way these stupid liberal laws are, one never knows..

There are so many different jurisdictions (state, county, city, township), and 'anti-concealed carry' laws out there that it isn't funny.
That's why I never carried 'Bertha' in the truck.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v110/southernrain/ruger44mag.jpg

[ATCO]

Love the trigger lock there Dave... :D

[DrivingZiggy]

Darn lucky you werent in Massatchusets.....Most likely be looking at a felony right about now.. :yikes: .....

I dont know why anyone put themselves at risk, by carrying a firearm across state lines, especially someone that does a lot of military loads..

This is by no means an anti gun post......A person should have a right to carry a firearm....Just with the way these stupid liberal laws are, one never knows..Massachusetts is very opressive. But as long as you do it the right way, there should not be a problem.

There is no law preventing you from carrying any LEGAL weapon across state lines. The McClure-Volkmer Act of 1986 ensures that a state cannot prohibit you from doing so. They can, however, tell you how to carry it. You know, in a locked case and unloaded.

Doing the military loads can get to be a hassle. It seems like no 2 bases have the same procedure. Some let you leave it at the gate. Some make you take it somewhere else.

[Big_Dave]

Love the trigger lock there Dave... :D
Ahh...but it ain't a trigger lock. I used a 3" 12 gauge shell to prop the firearm up enough so it was easier to photograph. :D

[Crystal Pistol]

Ouch ..... :yikes:

About the "confab going in another office with somebody else", having been in on a few over the years with other officers, often ... most often actually ... it's either a less experienced officer seeking advice about law or department procedure ... or it's a discussion centered along the issue of placing a charge as maybe has been done in other cases, but watering it down in view of the facts of the particular case at hand (showing some leniency). There are certain places in state law where it states flatly that a charge shall be placed in certain circumstances and others where one may be placed. One wording gives an officer room to show more appearant leniency, the other leaves less room. There are likewise, places where a policy exist calling for narrow range of options that an officer may chose from in a certain circumstance. There are times when an officer not following the established policy or law constitutes a violation of policy and / or law which could subject the officer to administrative repremand and / or dismissal and / or even prosecution criminally. Not something an officer is willing to risk for a stranger usually.

If a weapon is taken, if convicted, and after all appeals are exhausted, a court order for destruction is issued and the weapon must be so destroyed after all appeals are exhausted unless the court gives it back. A weapon later being found that was so ordered destroyed can put that evidence custodian or officer at risk of prosecution, and it ain't woth it.


What you do about contesting it depends more on you and your knowledge before hand. Perhaps the DA up there will talk to you? :)

[DrivingZiggy]

Whew! At last a post with some useful information! Thanks, CryPis.

I think I'll give that a shot. I mean, since I plead to the misdemeanor disorderly conduct, there was no longer a weapons charge of any sort. So I may be eligible to get my pistol back.

[Crystal Pistol]

It's certainly worth looking into. Not every LEO of prosecutor is out to "get you" as many believe, they too have family, often family that drive trucks even.
There may well have been some provision in state law, a technical sort of thing, that made what seemed innocent to you into a real violation in that jurisdiction, there are minute differences from state to state and all states do not honor concealed carry permits from all other states as you know.

You may hear someone mention taking the case under advisement for a period of time, after which if no further occurences show up, it may be dismissed after court costs are paid.

For years, I traveled and being a LEO, I always took a weapon that I could afford to "loose" in case it was taken, but I took it off my side and secured it nearby, out of sight in the car I was driving or on the GoldWing. I didn't carry it on my person outside of Va. I did so because until just last year, there was no national right to carry for LEOs even and there were many cases of even LEOs having weapons taken in foreign jurisdictions (other states). That changed recently with a federal law that grants such rights to all LEOs qualified to carry. I took the chance those many years simply because I was concerned about running into, or seeing a situation along a highway where a LEO might be in trouble and need assistance, I wanted to be able to help if I could without placing my family in grave danger. I often thought of the bus driver that saved a Florida trooper who was being forced into her own car's trunk at gunpoint many years ago.

In any case, good luck ............ :)

[Wrongway]

Wow! What a comedy of errors.
That rent-a-cop's boss really needed to confer with the base commander before taking any other action.
The base has it's own rules for visitors I'm sure.
The local cops and the SPD may not have jurisdiction on the base until or unless the MP's give it to them.
The MP who thought you were in trouble for carrying across state lines must be one of those TS lawyers too.
It's not up to him to decide whether or not you're guilty of a state or local crime.
None of this should have happened in the first place.
You should try to get your piece back.

As much as I'm not a big fan of LEO's, I will say that I have never met one that wasn't understanding about a truck driver "carrying" with a valid state permit from somewhere.

I've been stopped a time or two, declared my weapon, permit and their respective locations.

I've been "drawn on", made to retrieve & put it in the officers keeping for the duration of the stop or allowed the officer to locate it himself and become assured that I wasn't going for it... however he/she wanted to play it.

Not once was I cited for it nor made to give it up. Even in upstate NY.

This has a lot to do with how you present yourself and first impressions.

I have even been thanked for declaring myself "up front" even though I surprised a couple officers with my declaration.

Personally, I am not bashfull about declaring the presence of a weapon on-board before anything else transpires.
I think it "eases" the situation when you give up the element of suprise right away.
I'm just guessing on that.

By the way, my weapon is always holstered & concealed, never unloaded nor out of reach in the truck. I never take it out just to impress / show anyone.

This is not bragging.
This is only about the 2nd time I've ever admitted in public that I carry. I've just been lucky in getting the right kind of cop when stopped.

I would rather carry & take my chances on getting an understanding cop than not have it and take my chances with a worse situation.

This is not an advocacy to carry. Just relating personal experiences.
Your gas mileage may vary.

[Arresting_Quack]

There are federal laws regarding the carrying of firearms. A quick search of the web netted information from the ATF's web site. I used "federal firearms regulations" as a search phrase at www.msn.com.

The ATF's web site was the first link on the list of web sites.

Be safe.

[MoonRunner]

I have never taken a firearm from a truck driver as long as he or she had a permit from their home state. I do appreciate being told that they have one prior to me finding it or seeing it and getting that lump in my throat.

[nitestar]

I want to know DZ. were you on GVT property? if so How did the base allow it to become a civil deal.

If Ft Drumm has MP's they should have handled it . Real simple. I think you have a case here and you need to get the chain of command that this mishap took. ( someone wanted that gun. They now have it.)
Who called who and why. Some one dropped the ball . I think it was the rent a cop.
All the rent a cop had to do was hold the gun till you left the premises.
My opinion is he or she was not properly trained.

I used to deliver to the prisons in Ky and only had one give me a hard time about my gun. I simply backed up to the black top and had them come out to unload their stuff. The rest accepted my gun in the ditty bag and turned it over to me when I left.

We were at a base in TX. a driver for ATS came in to deliver a load. He was asked if he had guns knives or cameras and other contrband. He said no.
It was his turn. The truck searched. They found several guns. All were muzzle loaders and some were antiques. rifles and pistols, but a fire arms none the less.
He was not allowed to enter the property and ATS had to send another driver to pull the trailer in and unload it. Had the driver declared the guns all would have been well. They would have been locked up till he returned from unloading.
No-one got excited. but then again it was not NY,

My advice is to not carry the gun in the CMV and you will not be bothered again.
Want the right to carry one in the truck, help get the laws changed.